From: Badger_s
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: The Kidney Punch
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2006 15:46:44 -0400
Message-ID: 6f0l42960j4l2i3bkopjgkndfj4muklcur@4ax.com

On Sat, 22 Apr 2006 13:11:59 -0600, "Chas" 
wrote:

>"Badger_s" wrote
>> Wonder why in boxing the kidney punch is illegal if it's ineffective?
>
>Same reason as the eye-gouge, headbutt, fish-hooking and the groin strike- 
>an un-necessary bow to tradition and outmoded technic.

Heh. You still see guys in boxing hitting to that area, occasional rabbit
punches to the back of the neck; you even see headbutting, though it's
supposedly unintentional. Part of the arsenal of 'dirty boxing' - get away
with what you can, I 'spose. 

I'm surprised they don't have more pushing the glove aside and hitting
overtop, or deceiving the push and hitting underneath. I've seen it a
couple times in MMA - Fedor did it quite well in a recent Pride match.

I was IM-ing my brother when the Kimo-Royce match was on and though he's
aware of the rules not prohibiting anything but biting and eyegouging in
UFC 1, he commented it was 'pulling hair like a girl' when Royce grabbed
Kimo's topknot. 

It's weird how some stuff get's dubbed like that. Used to be they called
using the foot 'kicking like a girl' back in the 50s (at least in America).
As I mentioned in another post, I'm sure that I'd have been kicked out of
class in the 60s-70s for trying any kind of take-down, or guillotine (I
nearly was), even carefully applied. Heh, probably would have been allowed
a flying armbar, though, because, hey, they loved the spectacular
low-percentage stuff, lol.

Yep, back then you couldn't kick the legs, could't throw an elbow, couldn't
use a head spear, couldn't grab the neck, or punch to the face (even with
pads). Couldn't even grab the gi. Seems ridiculous especially given that
all the arts were supposed to be geared to 'self-defense'. It sure was a
code duello. The first thing that's gonna happen on the street is you get
grabbed and punched, someone kicks the groin, throws an elbow, headbutts. 

>> think it's because of the lack of musculature over the floating rib, 
>> myself and really has nothing to do with the 'kidney' per se. Just a thought.
>
>Yeah; the pissing-blood-part is a party trick.

That's an after-effect. Nobody's targetting the kidney in order to cause an
effect after the fight are they? I'm just suggesting that the shot to the
lower back is really a floating rib, liver attack and not an immediate
effect of something related to kidney percussion. Guess it doesn't matter -
that they call it the kidney punch might just be a misnomer.

Still if stabbing the kidneys has such a strong effect, I suppose hitting
them might induce weakness. This is the area that some fighters target with
a heel when in guard and where there heel hits is probably much closer to
being over the kidneys than the small of the back. Not trying to force a
conclusion, just discussing, you know.

>> It's not an illegal blow in MMA, afaik, and I rarely, if ever, have seen a
>> guy go down from a 'kidney punch'.
>
>You should see the Vale Tudo matches in Dubai- they get kidney-punched, and 
>they *like* it.

I hear Shammy likes getting his face pounded into hamburger; so much so
that he's planning to do it again with Tito. ;-)

-B

>Chas 
>

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